Life / Religion / Philosophy / Science / Polictics

Tag: Skepticon

  • In Search of God

    The other day in Whose Science Is It?  I stated:

    “Once one has determined in his or her own mind as to the existence of God, then the debate as to who or what that God may (or may not) be can take place.”

    Meaning to separate two linked, but unique, practices:  Theology and Religion.  But I kind of left Theology hanging.  Today I’d like to take the time to fill that in a little bit, and I am sure I am being somewhat academic to most, but I feel it important because I believe that a vast majority of people that miss God in their lives, do so because they reason themselves out of it.  By this I mean they find themselves to have studied the evidence and determined to their own satisfaction that there is indeed no God.  Likewise, a number of Theists also believe they have reasoned themselves to their position without actually realizing the steps they needed to take, or accept, to get there.

    The reason I find this important, is because of people like Dr. Richard Carrier.  Dr. Carrier, apparently following Dr. Richard Dawkins advice to mock Christians (and in doing so demonstrated his physic abilities, since I believe Dr. Dawkins advice came after this event), asks the rather mocking question: Are Christians Delusional? at Skepticon 3.

    Of course one might ask why someone with a BA in History, an MA in Ancient History, an MPhil in Ancient History (Honestly, I did not even know you could get a Masters of Philosophy in Ancient History), and a PhD in Ancient History from prestigious institutions such as University of California, Berkeley, and Columbia University is doing speaking at a convention named Skepticon?  Shouldn’t Dr. Carrier be off doing some important History research or teaching some University course somewhere rather than speaking at some convention full of self proclaimed skeptics?

    See?  I can be mocking and condescending as well.  I should point out that I never have actually attended Skepticon (although I have watched the videos and read the literature) and do not personally know anyone who has.  They may actually be a great bunch of fun loving people.  But their choice of invited speakers certainly leaves a lot to be desired.

    But back to my point:  I would most certainly guess that Dr. Carrier believes Theists to be duped somehow.  Incapable of understanding or interpreting Scientific Data.  Or else needy, emotionally, psychologically, mentally, or otherwise.  And they need a God to fill that void.

    And of course Dr. Carrier would be partially right.  There is a void in a persons life that needs to be filled (even Dr. Carrier’s life).  But it is not a needy void, it is an empty void.  And it does not lie quite where one might suspect.  Rather it is a Spiritual void.  And Spiritual voids just happen to be God shaped voids.  And oddly enough, only God can fill that void.

    Atheists do not understand that.  How could they?  They deny there is a God to begin with and  shut out any possibility of a Spiritual realm or Spiritual understanding.  And they may not even know why it is seemingly important for them to proselytize as Dr. Carrier and others most assuredly do.  This is a thought for a future post however.

    So back on track here.  Just how delusional are Theists?  We let’s consider the choices (either consciously, or sub-consciously) that the Theist has to make in order to arrive at their particular world view.

    Obviously, to begin with, one must determine whether the evidence supports a Theistic model or an Atheistic model.

    At this point the Atheist is done.  There is no God (or gods).  The Universe is not a created thing.  And there certainly is no need to go looking for one.

    Now some Atheist out there is going to interject Science and Discovery at this point.  They are going to claim that learning how it all started, what makes it all work, or what holds it all together is the important next step.

    I do not understand how in the world these people came to think they are they only ones capable of Science.  It is just not logical.  I would argue that Discovery is a logical next step for ANY world view, Theistic or Atheistic.  We all want to do that.  I believe the next step of Discovery, Science, Philosophy, Politics, is just a part of Life.  It is what we are all made up of and what we all delve into.

    So no, at the point of there is no God, the Atheist’s work is done.  They are simply going to engage in the same set of practices as the rest of us at this point.

    But not so with the Theist.  The Theist still has a lot of work left to do.  Once the Theist says there is a God, suddenly they are faced with another choice:

    Monotheistic or Polytheistic?  I suppose you could punt and go with Pantheistic if you wanted to, but the point is this is not something you want to get wrong.  You need to know, is there an entire race of God’s?  Are there multiple Gods, and if so, who is the head God?  Is there a single God?  And if so, who or what is it?

    In either case, the Monotheist and the Polytheist cannot stop there.  They must then determine who or what God (God’s in the case of Polytheism) is.  Once again, this is not something you want to get wrong.  It could possibly have dire consequences to identify the wrong God.

    Once both the Monotheist and the Polytheist believe they have identified God (or God’s), they still are not done.  Because then they must ask the most important question one will ever ask.  So what? And this is not a rhetorical or flippant question.  They must both seriously ask the question, So what does this mean to me?  Am I beholden to God?  Do I owe God anything?  How do I seek after God?  Learn about God?  Get in touch with God?  Does God even want to get in touch with me?

    Once the theist begins to ask the questions about God and start to seek answers both physically, spiritually, philosophically, and emotionally, they begin a journey much more complicated than the Atheist will ever walk.  The Atheist simply skips all of these challenges (God?  What God?  There is no God so I need not search for one or decide on which one is real.)  The Atheist gets to punt here and move on.  But not so with the Theist.  The Theist must walk this path whether they realize they do so or not.

    The Theist’s path is fraught with many more questions, puzzles, growing pains, challenges, debates, and I would conjecture joys and pains, than any other path out there.

    And Dr. Carrier asks the question (in jest or not) Are Christians Delusional?  Sure they are Dr. Carrier.  Because that is what delusional people do.  They undertake the really hard choices.  They walk the difficult path, to the point of all exclusion.  They constantly go through the fire and yet still walk out the other side.  Just like all the other delusional people in the world.  How about yourself?

  • LRPSP

    LRPSP. com has been up for over a week now and I thought I’d step back and provide some foundation for the categories, my biases, and the general discussions.  The About page provides an overview of the Blog, however I thought that over time a little more detail might be provided.  This is a short introduction.

    The pillars of the site – Life / Religion / Politics / Science / Philosophy are the foundations we exist upon.  I have collapsed some of the categories for the sake of a short, catchy URL (at least I hope it is catchy), but for the most part the things that make up our world and make us who we are fit into these categories.  They are also the categories where the most passionate debates come from.  These are the discussions about who we are, how did we get here, why are we here, where are we going, what are we supposed to be doing, and what does it all mean?

    if you were to look at an apologetics course such as The Truth Project – hosted at Focus On The Family you will find pretty much the same core of pillars.  These pillars are also where apologists such as Dr. Ravi Zacharias, Dr. Del Tackett, or Josh McDowell might build their cases on.

    I am nowhere near as talented as either one of these three individuals, or others like them, but I do have an understanding of the basics, and I enjoy a heart-to-heart conversation.  And I’d like to invite anyone and everyone to join in the conversations.  Especially those that are dissenters, such as these folks that obviously take issue with Josh McDowell’s book Evidence That Demands A Verdict.

    Of course this is a family oriented site so the rules are somewhat strict.  Of course that doesn’t mean we cannot have adult discussions from time-to-time, but it does mean that a certain level of civility and a language code will be insisted upon.

    The pillars cover the following:

    Life– Everything that animates us that we experience, know, and deal with on a day-to-day basis.  Life covers the physical, our bodies, our world and our interactions with it, our souls, our emotions, thoughts, and what makes us laugh, what makes us cry.  Life covers all the unique characteristics that make you – you and me – me.  These could be hobbies, sports, interests, studies, jobs, interactions, or anything else that makes us the unique creations we are.

    Religion– Everything within the Spiritual world and our connection with God.  Religion may encompass Theology, our innermost selves, Heaven, Hell, Angels, Demons, and all things of a Devine nature.

    Politics– Would cover our Governments, our laws, things that govern our social interactions, or even the application, adjudication, or interpretation of those laws.  Governments (and thus politics) do not necessarily exist at the Capitol buildings and no where else.  They generally permeate our entire lives.  Homeowners Associations are a form of Governance (and are generally found to be the bottom rung of government).  However, Politics may even extend into the home and the family structure.

    Science– Is all the sciences.  Biology, Sociology, Anthropology, Archaeology, Geography, Chemistry, Physics, Mathematics, etc.  the Sciences are important because they facilitate our discovery and our understanding of the world around us.

    Philosophy– Our Philosophies are what define and establish our World Views.  They help shape how we see things and through what colored lenses we interpret things.

    Obviously by now, if you have followed any of my timeline, or read my blog posts from the beginning, you might surmise that my World View encompasses a God.  I believe Theology (I just grouped this under Religion) is the foundational study of all.  It is the foundation upon which everything else is built.

    It should be clear by now that my Theological Foundation is the ground floor that all other pillars sit upon.

    And I would like to point out that all great minds start out here (not that I am saying that I am a great mind, but rather that I am a good student and have learned from them).

    Even amongst our high level contemporary thinkers, Dr. Richard Dawkins, Dr. Richard Carrier, Dr. Stephen Hawking, and (of course) Dr. Ravi Zacharias, and Dr. Del Tackett, all of these start with Theology.

    What is it that consumes Dr. Dawkins completely?  Why it is to disprove the existence of God.  Dr. Stephen Hawking’s latest book, The Grand Design, states “It is reasonable to ask who or what created the universe, but if the answer is God, then the question has merely been deflected to that of who created God.” (The Grand Design, pg. 165, 1st paragraph).  Dr. Carrier is certainly consumed by Christians (if not God), see part of his talk at Skepticon 3 (or just search YouTube for him).  All of these individuals are consumed with Theology, the study of God.  Granted, their study intends to disprove the existence of God, but you cannot disprove that which you do not study.

    Clearly all great minds agree that Theology is foundational to any other study we may pursue.  It provides us insight into other studies and (as Dr. Hawking points out in his book on pg. 164), it is a necessary study to answer the questions: “Why is there something rather than nothing?  Why do we exist?  Why this particular set of law and not some other?” just before he launches into a Theological discussion of God.

    But I hope you don’t think all of my Blog discussions will be some boring, unintelligible diatribe about Religion, or Politics, or Philosophy, or Science.  No, I’d like to discuss the fun parts, the sad parts, and the parts of life that interest you as well.

    It is sincerely my hope you will see the importance and value of these pillars, and that they will help  guide your input, but if not, don’t worry about it.  Either read for fun, or join in to share you opinion.

    But let’s have a conversation about: Life/Religion/Politics/Science/Philosophy!